Don't worry about Isp. Any of my search term words; All of my search term words; Find results in. You can post now and register later. Also, Valley and Theomon fly to different corners of Kerbin and three mapping satellites are launched. Subscribe - http://www.youtube.com/c/MikeAben?sub-confirmation=1 Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/MikeAbenPatreon supporters receive early, ad-free, access to videos, kOS and craft files, and more. Discord - https://discord.gg/HTvT7dZ Making Space Home Playlist - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLB3Ia8aQsDKhqoFyoZ4d33MG7rS9KmDm_0:00 - Designing the Dudley Mk16:42 - Test Flights \u0026 Iterating13:45 - Col. Valley take the Seaplane to the Northern Ice Shelf19:30 - Launch \u0026 Insertion of the Maxwell Vb21:04 - Col. Theomon \u0026 Orlin Visit the Badlands in the Panther24:20 - Launch \u0026 Ejection of the Maxwell VI26:34 - Designing the SENTINEL 129:47 - Launch \u0026 Insertion of the Maxwell VIIFull List of Mods: Aviation Lights Chatterer Community Tech Tree Crew R\u0026R Croud Sourced Science Contract Configurator Contract Packs: Bases and Stations Reborn CommNet Relays Exploration Plus Field Research Kerbal Academy Tourism Plus Contracts Window+ Decoupler Shroud Easy Vessel Switch Kerbal Alarm Clock Kerbal Attachment System Kerbal Construction Time Kerbal Engineer Redux Kerbal Inventory System Kerbalism kOS KRASH Maneuver Node Evolved Navball Alignment Indicator Near Future Aeronautics Near Future Construction Near Future Electrical Near Future Propulsion Near Future Solar Near Future Spacecraft Persistent Rotation Rational Resources RCS Build Aid Continued Restock Restock+ SCANsat Scrapyard SMART Parts Stage Recovery Stockalike Station Parts Expansion Redux TAC Fuel Balancer Texture Replacer Trajectories Transfer Window Planner Universal Storage 2 Unkerballed Start Waypoint Manager I got this game so I could over-engineer rockets, so I mostly ignore the airplanes. Clear editor. Hopefully this will be helpful to you. It may take some practice to hit your target area this way, because you'll be picking up additional horizontal speed, and thus it's possible to under or overshoot. Also, jets eat fuel at pounds-per-minute -- if you cover twice as much ground in the same time, your plane will be more efficient. I recommend using a solid rocket booster (or 2 or 5) to you get you the altitude and then launch a small rocket powered plane. Fighting oscillations. That would argue for going as high as possible, as slow as possible, but apart from drag you also have to fight gravity. All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. Thanks for asking this, I've been struggling with the same problem in career mode. The ideal case for optimally efficient flight (which is what you want if you're trying to maximize cruise altitude) is when your wings are mounted to the body, pitched up just enough that when cruising in level flight, the body of the aircraft is pointing perfectly . In the stock atmosphere, the benefits of moving faster outweigh almost everything else. Though I'm still working on learning to be better at space planes. Yes, although they have only been flown with nearly full tanks. It will be expensive and time consuming. Air Flow: Air Flow represents with how much force air passes the turbine (notice: different amounts of air at the same speed equals in different amounts of force!). So Pvt. TLDR: You need parts you don't have to make a plane that flies that high. Just sounds like the engines can't get enough air, in KSP high speed also generates air intake so I'm guessing what is happening is that you have the initial speed to get to altitude but the lack of air at altitude is starving the engine resulting in lower speed which further reduces air intake and it cascades until either the engine shuts down or you return to denser atmosphere at a lower altitude. 3.) 101 kPa 1 atm Scale Height 5000 m Atmospheric Height 69 077.553 m 1.010-6 atm Minimum Temprature -40.19 C 232.96 K Maximum Temprature 20 C 293.15 K Oxygen Present Yes Contents 1 Kerbin 2 Topography 3 Kerbal Space Center 4 Atmosphere 4.1 The Troposphere 4.2 The Stratosphere 4.3 The Thermosphere 4.4 The Exosphere 5 The Kerbin System 5.1 The Mun It was meant for low altitude flight. Display as a link instead, Kerbal Space Program 2 . 1Altitude requirement 2Orbit 3Speed, range, and altitude 4Flight duration 5Flight profiles 5.1Ballistic missiles 5.2Tourist flights 5.3Scientific experiments 5.4Sub-orbital transportation 6Notable uncrewed sub-orbital spaceflights 7Crewed sub-orbital spaceflights 8Future of crewed sub-orbital spaceflight 9See also 10References I looked into the .cfg files and there are no special properties allocated to them. as a rule of thumb they all lose thrust at higher altitudes and at high velocities. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. I was generally under the impression that basic jets were mostly deadweight on high-performance aircraft: while they are superior for low-speed, low-altitude operations, they become deadweight at hypersonic velocities. Originally posted by lord bird: yep thats right jool has a surface. What are the minimum altitudes for each warp level? Is it correct to use "the" before "materials used in making buildings are"? Make sure you've angled your wings up slightly so that you provide enough lift for a 0 angle of attack at top speed. This means it is better to have excessive amounts of oxygen than not to. Or it can supercruise at three times the speed of an equivalent Wheesley jet (with nearly equal fuel efficiency) at 15,000 m altitude. Paste as plain text instead, In the main KSP settings menu you should set the default throttle to 1.0 (technically the above mechjeb setting winds up restoring the default throttle, so it needs to be 1.0) In the attitude adjustment menu make sure you are using the "better controller" Whack the 45 degree phase margin button Whack the restore all other defaults button Can't remember where I saw/read about it - Scott Manley maybe? Welcome to the forums. Using Kolmogorov complexity to measure difficulty of problems? This tutorial will cover designing and flying a plane that can soar at high altitudes! For all your gaming related, space exploration needs. I decided to look into that two intakes thing, and it turns out to make 11-12 m/s difference at 19,000m with my plane. Technically, any rocket engine is also a jet engine as it forms a high-speed jet of reaction mass. These are the building blocks of solid spaceplane design!Subscribe! 600+ m/s) and low altitudes (e.g. If your using NEAR/FAR, once you get high and fast, kill the engine and glide to save fuel. The second, Wet mode, uses the afterburner to produce thrust almost equal to the J-X4 "Whiplash" Turbo Ramjet Engine, but at a considerably reduced fuel efficiency. Paste as plain text instead, When added to a plane it allows tuning of the controls vs speed/altitude/G load/other factors. You'll notice that usually your prograde marker is slightly below your pitch. Powered by Invision Community. My 'plane science' is more advanced than my 'rocket science' (career mode) because I got tired of seeing all the high-altitude missions I had on the books and wanted to finish them. Even up there the plane acts squirrely. I wasn't expecting so many excellent answers! As I understand, the OP wanted "the most efficient way to fly", and simply needed a bit of help in realizing that that is a hypersonic, high-altitude, high-performance aircraft which is a RAPIER and a little oxidizer away from being an SSTO spaceplane. (Disclaimer: I've never used FAR myself; all of the above is based on my experience with stock aerodynamics. These designs are great for getting around Kerbin quickly, but without going orbital. You need to do it with what you've got. http://www.youtube.com/user/Cruzanak?sub_confirmation=1Quicklinks to topics in this videoJet Engine Concepts: 0:30Air Intakes: 1:13Flameouts: 2:22Control Surfaces: 5:08Flying Tips: 5:57This video will go over everything that you need to know about to design a capable plane that can fly in the thinnest of atmospheres. What altitude and speed should I go? Really. I'd almost expect it to work better in stock since infini-gliders can be done. Remember that you need to have intakes somewhere in line with the engine to function at that altitude. You cannot paste images directly. . below 5,000 m), since the engine's extreme maneuverability may allow the aircraft to perform turns sharply enough to break up in flight. Either of the two speeds are to be avoided. Content titles and body; Content titles only This is particularly useful for pairs of engines, since this makes it possible to keep the thrust equal when activating the afterburners. Or about the same speed but 1000 m higher. Immediately starting rocket engines at full throttle turned out to make most of my aircrafts totally unstable, turning them up gradually worked way better. You are simply running out of atmosphere (i.e. Air Flow + max. Each stage of the rocket has a delta-v that depends on the stage fuel mass and the engine specific impulse. To get there, you're going to want to climb at the fastest rate you can manage to 18-20 km, at which point you should mostly level off and start accelerating horizontally. AoA built into the wing relative to the plane body is called the angle of incidence, just to help clear up. Note that you need to activate the afterburner ("Wet Mode") manually. Editing Kerbal Space Program save files for KSO, Rasterpropmonitor for Kerbal Space Program. Using very light "engine rich" planes and "reverse swooping" (building velocity at 10km then gently curving up) you can temporarily get above 20km with Wheesely and Juno. Kerbal Space Program Jool Landing Youtube. Under some circumstances, you may want to reduce the engine gimbal range or disable it altogether, particularly when flying at high speeds (e.g. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. That will probably allow you to fly comfortably above 20-25km (or higher, depending on the overall mass of your aircraft). But since when do Kerbals wait for ideal conditions? If it's below the cross-hairs, you need a little more AoA. If you enter the Mun's SOI, it immediately counts as "In Space High over Mun" until you get below 60km Mun altitude. 20 votes, 21 comments. In this case lots of fuel is the wrong approach, I can get more than half way around Kerbin on 2 cans of Jet Fuel and a turbojet if I glide most of it. There are two factors to that: how thick the air is, how fast the ship is going. You may be correct and that 3 engine plane is a lemon. Basically I can hit a target altitude of 20,000m but can not maintain it. 1 1: The basics 2 2: Setting it up 3 3: First flight 4 4: Finishing touches 1: The basics First of all, you're going to need an airplane. Let me share what I know about jet engines, speed, and efficiency. Delta wings are able to work better since the lack of lift per square area is compensated by having larger area to provide lift. (the engines will use very little at high altitude anyway). Display as a link instead, To avoid running out of fuel altogether, I have a second plane with small tanks (no oxidizer) attached directly to the jet engines, and the rockets attached behind the fuselage, which is entirely oxidized tanks. As long as the engine gets enough air it will work at proper efficiency. Main goals: Auto-trimming. Right now, my big, fat plane has trouble breaking 10 km altitude and 200 m/s forward speed (largely due to its payload). The longest flight got them down to a little more than half full. But maybe your patience? air) that high up. Unfortunately I won't be able to test it today, but @SaintWacko's proposal sounds promising. The Boeing X-37, also known as the Orbital Test Vehicle (OTV), is a reusable robotic spacecraft. This lowers their effective "weight"-- for example, a craft flying at 1400 m/s on Kerbin is effectively flying as if gravity were only 2/3 of its actual value. One of my planes is small and agile, and can easily enough glide to a safe landing even if the rockets consume all the fuel. i recently used a single whiplash plane and was able to maintain a stable 21-22k meter altitude. But you'll need to unlock: Which cost 300 science. Remembering the FW TA152 and the U2 I put long wings on it and while its turn rate makes an airliner look like a fighter plane it is stable enough at 19000m. I also set it to enable the cockpit's reaction wheels to improve control at high altitude, and close air intakes to reduce drag. How do I align things in the following tabular environment? Pasted as rich text. It is designed to aid in player-controlled flight on generic (space)plane, providing a soft layer between user joystick\keyboard input and control surface outputs. I'm going to try adding a small solid fuel rocket engine toned down to get the initial height then dump it, as well as check into that high end gear mentioned. Designing a High Altitude Jet | KSP: Making Space Home Mike Aben 24.8K subscribers Join Subscribe 85 Share 3.4K views 1 year ago Ep. http://kerbalspaceprogram.com, Press J to jump to the feed. Have a plane that ditches its wings and rockets up to 18km once you reach the right point. Dedicated to the growth and advancement of amateur rocket scientists! AoA itself refers to the angle of the wing (or the whole plane if the AoI is 0)relative to the airflow. - Spamming airintakes didn't help. Pasted as rich text. A destructible memorial to the old Mk. If you want to cover your aircraft with loads of intakes, I'm sure you could easily fly above 35km and reach 2000+ m/s velocity. - "In Space High" means your craft is inside the given Sphere of Influence and above the "Space Border" altitude listed in the Celestial Body Multiplier Matrix. There is no such thing as "so high radar can not detect it", since radar can detect things in outer space. If too little air runs into the turbine your combustion chamber will not be able to burn up fuel effectively due to the lack of oxygen. If drag were the only concern, at any given altitude the slower you go, the less fuel you need: the work done by drag over a distance grows linearly with speed (the force grows quadratically with speed, but the time falls linearly). high-2 A Screenshot of Kerbal Space Program It is boosted into space by a launch vehicle, then re-enters Earth's atmosphere and lands as a spaceplane. But you'll need to unlock: High Altitude Flight Which cost 300 science. Planes in Space. There are no requirements as far as size or power are concerned, as the AI Pilot is capable of flying pretty much anything - from tiny scout planes to oversized freight craft. This makes jets built using this engine considerably more maneuverable. The most efficient way is, of course, to make a high altitude (or space) plane. *I use FAR these days, which basically means completely replacing every spaceplane and rocket you ever designed to account for its much more realistic aerodynamics. ksp high altitude planebad bunny tour 2022 tickets ksp high altitude plane. - "In Space High" means your craft is inside the given Sphere of Influence and above the "Space Border" altitude listed in the Celestial Body Multiplier Matrix. Thanks for the help! Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Whiplash is the engine you would want to use on a plane meant to go 20km. Your airspeed is mostly limited by terminal velocity; you can go much faster if you climb a little higher. It is usually best for initial designs to be based on logic and real-world physics and then be prepared to experiment with non-logical alternatives for optimisation. The benefits should be obvious. surface of jool. Once you're at that regime, you should be able to cover huge distances on tiny amounts of fuel. Which is capable of high altitude, high speed flight. Mounting a time-limited rescue mission for kerbal inbound to Kerbin. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. It is stable but can not maintain altitude. This can make it a good alternative for when you want something that can be controllable and doesn't need excessive heat shielding, but still need to be able to go incredibly fast if necessary, at the expense of increased fuel consumption. Ideally, you'll want to avoid these contracts until you get the High-Altitude Flight tech node and the improved jet engine that comes with it. Additionally please know that .16 will feature new code that will change the way space planes work in every aspect. edited 6 yr. ago. Air temperatures vary with latitude and time of day. KSP Quick Guides: High Altitude Design and Flying - Stock v.23 Stoober AK 3.32K subscribers Subscribe 21K views 8 years ago This tutorial will cover designing and flying a plane that can soar. jet engine efficiency in this game is based on built in thrust curves. Well, this game isn't a perfect flight simulator yet, so it will be difficult to figure out. Cookie Notice How do you get out of a corner when plotting yourself into a corner. For more information, please see our at the very least, you'd need the panther, that'll get you over 16k easily, well to 25k. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. It'll probably be more efficient with more intakes, but I wouldn't increase the number of engines. Your link has been automatically embedded. But. I tried building a plane but can't climb higher than about 11,000m (I don't have many plane parts yet, though). Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Using indicator constraint with two variables, Is there a solution to add special characters from software and how to do it. That will unlock: "Whiplash" Turbojet Which is capable of high altitude, high speed flight. Turbojets are so ridiculously efficient that it doesn't really matter. I don't have the numbers handy, but you can expect something like 400m/s at 15km. Grichmann's answer has been the most reliable way I've found to complete these missions. Not only does it conk out at high altitudes, but also it conks out at high speeds, and you need to be able to go fast to fly up high. Its an approximation missing someelements. Evidence. Please consider starting a new thread rather than reviving this one. Your answer got me in the right direction, though I ended up with a different design (see my own answer). Clear editor. Unfortunately, most space plane designs are impossible (or at the very least impractical) at your current tech level. What's the difference between a power rail and a signal line? If it's below the cross-hairs, you need a little more AoA. Even better, burn a little more, and you can pop out of the atmosphere for a bit and avoid all that nasty drag stuff. 2.) If not, please explain why, which I know you have no problem doing! For comparison, the second most maneuverable engine is the CR-7 R.A.P.I.E.R. probably the easiest place to land in the system as terminal velocity is survivable for a craft less kerman. Be aware that heat buildup can gradually become a problem when the afterburners are used in sustained flight. KSP doesn't care (much) about aspect ratio; the total lift is the same regardless of configuration. You do get certain inertial and lever-arm effects, but those aren't really relevant to 'do I have enough lift to stay up'. You could try combining the two. Put a couple of radial mount parachutes just above the com and add a reaction wheel. Aircraft can be very temperamental to fly, especially on the keyboard. Now lets combine these two indicators: The best performance your engine can achieve is when you have an optimal amount of Air Flow (obviously) but also the MAXIMUM amount of Air Intake. Which makes this engine ideal for those missions which require doing many science activities above particular altitudes. With the tanks disconnected that way, the rockets don't leach from the jets. It only takes a minute to sign up. I start with the normal jet engines (which takes almost the complete runway). Air Intake) and how fast your aircraft ultimately flies (air resistance/altitude)! You arent doing anything wrong. However, it seems as if your delta wing has has more area, might that be it? even stranger is that the surface is textured. Thrust means that slower-is-better no longer applies: now, slower means less drag but more gravity, so there's a tradeoff (which I'm not going to carefully calculate for you, because it's hard). - "In Space Low" means your craft is inside the "Space Border" altitude and in an orbital path. Or it can supercruise at three times the speed of an equivalent Wheesley jet (with nearly equal fuel efficiency) at 15,000 m altitude. Yes. Let me. As has been said, ISP is nothing to worry about. Approximately 12km up the main engines stop providing enough thrust to maintain the climb, so it's time to switch to rocket mode. Unfortunately, there's no simple rule to tell you what the angle needs to be when you're building the plane-- it depends on lots of variables, such as your weight, drag, intended cruising altitude, intended cruising speed. Anyway thanks in advance. So that means that even if you are inside the atmosphere but still orbital (such as during aerobraking), your science will not count as "Inside the atmosphere", For example, orbiting Kerbin above 250km altitude, your science is counted as "In Space High over Kerbin." Don't be too surprised if KSP's aero model breaks down in edge cases. You cannot paste images directly. Either finish the low-altitudes and then spend all your fuel on the high-altitude boost, or do the boost first and save a little fuel or try to hit the rest through unpowered gliding. I'm in career mode and got all groups of the 45-science-cost level, except Flight Control, and additionally have Electrics, Heavy Rocketry and Fuel Systems. This means that the only thing that decides wheter your engines run efficient is determined by how much thrust they produce (opt. You can post now and register later. Slap that behind a plane you'll be able to go beyond 20km without any trouble. The most obvious solution is try and optimize your craft for high altitude lift by giving it long wingspan like a U-2 spyplane. if you just go into the SPH, slap together some parts like Legos, and go-- is to attach them with zero AoA. In the game, players direct a nascent space program, staffed and crewed by green humanoid aliens known as "Kerbals". I generally don't fuss with AoI unless I'm making a long range cruiser. Building a rocket to fly vertical seems to be nearly impossible, in the atmosphere they tend to become unstable (or maybe I missed a trick?). You can post now and register later. I find that a conservative amount is 2 RAM intakes and 2-4 radial intakes per turbojet. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? FBW uses three controllers - pitch, roll and yaw. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? Third, which I haven't given a good try, would be a carefully-timed deorbit maneuver so you come down through your desired location as you fall from space. If too much air runs into the turbine, the excessive amount just flows out unused through side-vents (I think). Use the reaction wheel to hold your attitude slightly nose down as you float down and you can guide yourself like a paraglider. The U-2 is probably the highest altitude aircraft still flying. Air Intake: Air Intake shows the amount of force your engine uses to suck air into the turbine. How to tell which packages are held back due to phased updates. Build a plane or rocket for Kerbal high altitudes, We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup, Screenshot of the Week #85 [Submissions Closed - Vote Now!]. 1.) principle. From my experience using a panther it starts to lose speed after 15-16 kms, a more suitable cruising height is 9-13km. The more successful the flights, the more successful the space program is. At sea level, it produces 120 kn thrust, but at 15 km altitude, it only produces 13.7 kn of thrust, barely enough to provide any thrust to climb higher, Long and narrow wing has less surface area to provide lift, and at higher altitude, the atmospher is so thin that the lift generated by long and narrow wings is insufficient for sustainable flight. Then it is "In Space Low over Mun.". It's Kerbal Space Program v.22! If it's above the cross-hairs, you need a little less. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Challenges I started by attaching two LV-909 rocket engines to a regular low-atmosphere plane: In this save, I don't have custom action groups yet, so I'm using the RCS control to toggle between jet and rocket modes. The Rapier, for example, works great as a high-altitude engine, precisely because it can go so fast. Thank you, I was able to reach up to 24km altitude with this design. The SR-71 could probably fly higher, but it isn't flying any more. The Inland Kerbal Space Center itself, being in effect the old Kerbal Space Center from 0.2. Rationale: If that's all a case of Too Many Words, think of it this way: Suppose you just build a plane the "default" way and don't put any AoA at all on the wings. I'm trying to build a high altitude plane and have found out that the rules are different. It's also worth noting that this engine has the widest thrust vectoring range of all of the jet engines, with a full 10-degree range in all directions. I also had problems with a high altitude plane until I decided to follow the K.I.S.S. I've added more engines, more intakes to no avail. Best way to get down into thicker air and land is to perform what dogfighters called a 'Split-S'. FAR is supposed to take aspect into account, but I'm not very experienced with it and cannot advice you as to how it works. How do I install mods for Kerbal Space Program 1.1? Ep. Privacy Policy. Thanks. Isn't that backwards snark? I don't have that other stuff yet. 2022 Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. Make sure we're on the same page with terminology.